S2E7 - Expo Exposed

Trevor and Kirk went to the Cannabis and Hemp Expo in Winnipeg Sept 30, 2018.  They talked to lots of fascinating people!  They brought you 4 stories.  Savethedrive.com's CEO Chanel Graham was a home care nurse when she saw a need for getting cannabis to people who couldn't leave their homes.  Brad Pattison of Brad Pattison Pet Wellness stops cats from launching aerial attacks on their owners.  Dr. Brent Guppy of Synthase Genetics can help producers identify the genes to make better cannabis strains.  Nathan the VP of Community Outreach with the Winnipeg 420 group talked about 420 in 2019.  Recreational Cannabis is legal, but will everyone at the event at the Leg now be fined?



This Episode is sponsored by Strainprint

Episode Transcript

Trevor: Kirk we are back.

Kirk: We are back.

Trevor: And you are in the studio with us this time,.

Kirk: I am, I am. Season Two.

Trevor: Episode 7.

Kirk: 7, I think just before we started thinking we should come up with a good a good drinking game.

Trevor: Yeah, because that's what health care professionals should have is a drinking game with your podcast.

Kirk: Every time you say that was another good interview.

Trevor: Or I say something about snot.

Kirk: Yeah. And or if I grunt a couple of times, people have a drink.

Trevor: Yeah. Well that that could work. But to be healthy about be healthy and safe about it.

Kirk: Well drink responsibly and drink and drink warm, cellar temperature beer with flavor.

Trevor: Okay.

Kirk: Yeah because we yeah. We don't want encourage drinking but if you're going to be doing it do it well.

Trevor: Sure.

Kirk: Welcome, welcome back to Reefer Medness - The podcast with Trevor and Kirk. I'm Kirk, right.

Trevor: I'm Trevor.

Kirk: I'm just back from a three-week journey in the north, so just getting used to cars and walking the streets of Dauphin.

Trevor: No good to have you back. So what are we talking about this week? I think we were we went somewhere.

Kirk: Yeah, we're trying to empty the can. We've got all these interviews that we have stored on in little bits and bytes on the CKDM radio station servers. And we're trying to we're trying to dump some of these interviews out. This is a this is a visit to Winnipeg.

Trevor: Yeah. We went to the Cannabis and Hemp Expo. I think we decided September 30th,.

Kirk: September 30, the day after my anniversary.

Trevor: Well, there you go.

Kirk: Yeah. Yeah. And that's how I remember it. And we had to forsake the Manitoba Podcast Festival to make it to the Expo.

Trevor: They are both at the same time. So hopefully we'll get to that one next year. But now this is so pre-legalization. So again, if the interviews we talk about what's going to happen in a couple of weeks, that's why. But I think everything we everything we saw there and everyone we talked to is still really applicable today.

Kirk: Yeah, well, we walked around, we walked around the different displays and different presenters, and it was really nice to be recognized. People actually do listen.

Trevor: But yeah. No, they're we've got some fans out there. Yeah. So Kirk, who are we going to talk to. Talk to you first.

Kirk: Well let's talk. That was did you get a drink. I just grunted there. We had a really good interview with Save the Ride.

Trevor: Yeah. No, she was she was really cool. She had people with her too. But the lady from Save the Ride she started out in your profession in nursing.

Kirk: Yeah.

Trevor: And she, she saw a need.

Kirk: Yeah. She saw a need. She was doing home care and she saw need in people who are using medicinal cannabis that could not get in. They are shut ins. So she came up with a theme. I mean, I'm a product of the 60s and 70s and I remember dial a bottle back in the day. I don't know if they still have that service. Back in the day, you could dial a bottle. And if you were a shut in, you could have somebody go get your booze for you. So this service is very similar. So she explained her service to us.

Trevor: She did. And she I love some of the examples you use because you don't think about that if you're not involved with home care, like, you know, some of these people, A, literally have no mobility issues to get to where they're going or you know what? She talked about a lady who had seizures or, you know, on her way to the dispensary. So this really was a if not life changer, a significant improvement in quality of life with this service.

Kirk: It's a good service. It's also now that we have legalization. I guess if you're too high to drive and you're out of a stash, you could call, Save the Drive.

Chenelle Graham:  I am from Save The Drive. And what we were just talking about is my background with home care nursing. I am a LPN by trade. And the idea of safe the drive was created because I was working in Vancouver doing home care nursing and a lot of my clients were having trouble accessing medical marijuana. There wasn't really anything great in place for them and so I thought how can we come up with something to help these mind mindset habitability issues they're feeling all of that and that's where Save the draft was was born.

Kirk: So your job then is to have patients. And they call you and say Can you please pick me up X STRAIN.

Chenelle Graham:  So, for me at that time I was just there doing their Medical needs and I was getting a lot of complaints about you know I need Cannabis. How Do i get it. I can't get out. So now with this in this business what we've created is something that's good for recreational and for medical users. And so now you sign up with your your I.D. to verify your age.

Kirk: And so I signed up on the web.

Chenelle Graham: Yeah.

Kirk: So what is your what is URL.

Chenelle Graham: So it's <safethedrive.ca>

Kirk: Are you national now across Canada.

Chenelle Graham: We're going to be launching in Edmonton Calgary Vancouver. Saskatoon Winnipeg and Montreal

Kirk: when do you launch?

Chenelle Graham: October 17.

Kirk: Oh cool. Yeah okay. And so I can go online and say I am a shut in. And I would like to have cannabis arrive to my home. Are you offering any education. Are you offering what are you doing.

Chenelle Graham:  So we can't offer an education and we can offer information. That's Basically the limit we have.

Kirk: So is it like a pizza delivery guy.

Chenelle Graham:  It's something similar to that. So what it is is a personal shopping platform. It connects the cannabis user with a personal shopper. The personal shoppers then able to act on behalf of the user. To go to the dispensary of their choice. Shop for the products they've chosen and bring them to the User.

Kirk:  And there's a fee for that.

Chenelle Graham:  There is it's roughly a seven dollar fee. OK. per grand or per deliver her delivery to 30 grams is the delivery Max.

Kirk: So those two people in the House have 60 grams?

Chenelle Graham: So current delivery is 30 grams. So what that means is the driver and the personal shopper themselves can only carry 30 grams.

Kirk That's the law.

Chenelle Graham: OK so let's say there was two people in the house and they wanted 60 grams. They would have to make two separate orders.

Kirk Now as a licensed practical nurse is there any limitations on the practice doing this.

Chenelle Graham:  I'm not currently practicing now.

Kirk: OK. So you get your license up So it's part of resume but no longer a nurse. What else would you like people to know about your business.

Chenelle Graham: I just think that it's very important for people that shouldn't be on the road. Number one intoxicated #2 people that have mobility issues. And then #3 you know I think that it's important. That people know there is a company that exists.

Kirk:  OK so that's an interesting. So back in the 70s or 80's it was dial a bottle we could dial a bottle and someone could bring me some booze. This is what this is about. I could be in the middle of a party and my stash is dead. I am too drunk to drive I can phones Save the Drive and you guys will bring my cannabis to my house. What a great business model. Yeah wonderful. Anything other question.

Trevor: how about a really interesting patient or client you had. You know that they've decided they couldn't live without. Like maybe one of your home care clients can you think of anyone in particular who you know about their name. But you know what's the circumstance that they're in and how does he go.

Chenelle Graham: So I had a Customer, Client in Vancouver that had epilepsy and so a huge issue was getting out of the house. And she had had an experience where she tried to go to the dispensary and had an epileptic seizure and ended up with the ambulance called and all types such a commotion just trying to get her medication. And so that's, that was the experience for me that was like we really have. Something available to us.

Kirk:  Once a nurse always a nurse. Thank you very much for the interview

Chenelle Graham: no problem.

Kirk: All right. Well, that's a good service. I wish I had thought of that.

Trevor: Yeah, no, she's very smart. And continuing on with a trend that I think we've got coming up. Why are all the really smart people we talked to in cannabis are "she". I think the guys need to catch up on this.

Kirk: Well it's interesting, you know, there's a lot of women in cannabis and what's happening right now, it seems like a lot of mainstream media is catching on to that. Is that there's a lot of women in cannabis. And that's OK because, you know, I heard a.

Trevor: It better than OK. They seem to have all the good ideas.

Kirk: Women have been ruling the world for a long time. Men just think they are. The next one we talked to was the dog whisperer.

Trevor: Yeah. Brad Pattison at the right. Yes.

Kirk: You got a great memory man.

Trevor: For something. So he was really neat on many things. And you talked to him more than I did. But I jumped in at the end because in pharmacy world I make stuff, I compound stuff, and sometimes I compound for pets. And getting stuff into a cat is harder than you think because they've got those tiny little pointy teeth. So the fact that he had a good idea for getting a medication into a cat, I just I need to hear about.

Kirk: Well, how about the chicken?

Trevor: Yeah. And the chicken and.

Kirk: The chicken that laid the egg.

Trevor: In the chicken that started laying the eggs, he had some really good stories about, well, CBD and pets.

Kirk: Yeah, well, and what I found interesting. now, this was pre legalization, right. Pre October 17th. And I was marveling at the fact that he was sitting there selling CBD products, which technically, I think at the time was illegal.

Trevor: Well. Well, I think he might it might still be illegal if it's not if you're still not a licensed retailer, honestly, we're open to being corrected on that. So you law people out there. Tell us if we got this wrong. But unless you were a licensed reseller, I think is what they're called, I still don't think it's you know, I still think CBD oil, if it's not, you know, at say the Tweed store, I think it's still in the gray zone.

Kirk: I don't know, man. That's why we did this podcast. We're trying to talk to people that are smarter than us. So we I just found it interesting. There it was. There is the product. Yeah. Let's listen to him.

Kirk: So we're we're at the Winnipeg where Brad Patterson's pet CBD, booth at the Winnipeg Expo. Brad my name is Kirk. Let's talk about CBD for pets.

Brad: Absolutely. So number one I want to clear one thing up, there is no THC in my product. It's CBD with certified organic hemp oil. All right. And people are finding incredible benefits with CBD for their parents from helping with seizures with anxiety with noise phobias with pain inflammation hip dysplasia all sorts of different issues that are happening with pets from lumps being large to shrinking. Really. Yes absolutely. And the wonderful thing is it's bringing peace of mind for so many pet owners. What I don't understand is how the media has had has group CBD with THC or CBD with medicinal marijuana. Those are two different things. They are similar. They're from a plant. Right. But you have the hemp plant and then you have a marijuana plant. So there's a massive conflict of interest for people listening to the information coming from the general pop of the media.

Kirk; So your CBDs are coming into sativa are they not.

Brad: No. It's from the hemp plant the hemp plant is . OK I hear what you are saying So if you want to keep this clean for the listeners. if I was extracting my CBD from a marijuana plant then I'm definitely going to be in the red zone with THC okay which the Government Health Canada have a huge issue with.

Kirk: So you're using a strain of plant that's high CBD correct. Right. OK so that's what you're doing. Yes. And you're extracting the CBDs from this hemp plant from This plant. And you have and you're giving it to dogs to pet to the cats. Yes chicken chicken chicken. Brad:  Hey listen there's a chicken it's started to drink the dog water that had CBD in it and started to lay eggs again. Right. OK. So who would have known. It is a miracle plant. It totally is. But let's not go back to the 1870s covered wagon and somebody sets up you know a miracle potion. Snake Oil,  But if you look at any of these cannabis shows. You see the professionalism. Yes it's been self govern by ourselves and the community like Aurora. If you take a look at low cloud you take a look at somebody like Sevenoaks or bonafide or CBD therapeutics. We're all working for the greater good. What I don't understand. Is For instance I've been on stage of a number of these shows. Why is the government not participating at these shows to help educate not just us business owners but also the general population. Interesting question. Why is health canada not. Working with the community with education. Education is pivotal here. Without education we have nothing. Right. We have rules and laws and, oh my gosh you're going to jail or you're going to get fined. And now there's this fear mongering that is not helping people. And my here's my my argument. I know of an elderly grandmother a great grandmother, if she can not get access to CBD just the CBD. She's not getting high. She cannot knit sweaters for her great grandchildren. Her greatest joy in life right now is knitting sweaters for her last four great grandchildren. So to classify or categorize CBD as this poison. Has this. Hallucinogenic drug right. When it. Comes from a simple plant. And. We. In my own personal opinion. There's way too much negativity and basis.

Kirk:  Put your. But you're focusing on making pets happy right your your nose your business is bettering the of lives of pets.

Brad:  Yes that is a fraction of what I'm doing OK. This is about wellness for the owner. Yeah because people now are having less children more pets. Yes a pet is not a PET anymore. DOG a CAT that's not that's not it. It's a companion. And I I'm a television host from three different television shows. I'm an author from four books of being independent history for 30 years. And. A pet is is much deeper emotionally engrained into a person's life more than ever today. So. My question to government. My question to the authorities is. How does this make any sense that you're taking CBD and you're categorizing it as a Schedule 1 or is scheduled two drug right. You're not getting stoned. You're not going to be driving drunk. You're not going to be doing anything wrong.

Kirk:  When I look at your products. When I look at your products I know more on I want to focus on the pet that you've got you've got three different levels of products for different pets correct. So this is obviously a pet focus pet centric. Yes but are these the same oils that humans can take. They say yes they are. What makes these pet centric. What makes your product pet.

Brad:  We labeled it for pets OK. People want peace of mind. If you take a look and we were using certified organic hemp oil. Right. That is the cleanest oil you can get. OK. We're not using organic. Organic is a little bit. It's just different. Yes. And then we have non GMO. We have French labeling we have a barcode we have an expiration. So this gives peace of mind to our buyers.

Kirk:  Is this legal today because I mean to be a CBD the user in Canada today you have to have a medical license. Right and yet you have a green card.

Brad:  Yes. For. And the conversation around pets is in a gray zone or a gray area that I've heard time and time again. Right. And, I understand we can just take a side go to veterinarians. I understand that. It's. Some veterinarians don't agree with this. They want more testing. I want more tests. Right. Right. Absolutely. Sort of like I

Kirk:  it's on the medical side doctors want more testing for the whole human consumption.

Brad:  Yes. But instead of starting it's step one go to Jerusalem go to Israel and speak to meca of knowledge; its out there. We don't need to start to recreate the wheel.

Kirk:  So you have sitting here for pets. Correct. So there's no law since you can do this for pets. It's interesting you gray zone because you can't so this currently to me I don't have a green card so I can buy the oil for me.

Brad:  I don't know that answer. I honestly don't know the answer because it's been a yo yo effect for weeks and months. And. As much as I appreciate the Trudeau government bringing marijuana into the legalization stage but what does that mean. Because what I'm hearing from more and more businesses is it's not legal. As we've been leed to believe. So. What does legalization of marijuana what does legalization of CBD or medicinal marijuana mean 's what it actually means.

Kirk: So that's five hundred milligrams in this jar's 30 mill and that one is 1500 correct. OK so they're the same concentration per mil. They just bigger a. Yes. So well in this one. This one's a little richer. This is 500 milligrams compared to 300 milligrams. Oh OK. OK. So this. So I've got anxious. What is it that there is a an Australian sheperd. he is anxious I put a drop on his kibble.

Brad:  Good question you would take the 500 milligram because rocket is 50 pounds you'd give her point three of a milligram once a day.

Kirk:  OK. And that will make her less anxious. Yes absolutely. you are very passionate

Brad:  our cat people today we've had so many cat people come to the show and the number one issue is anxiety with cats. We have one one cat owner here like we have to be careful if we're late coming home. The cat will attack us from above. Yeah. So they make sure that their cat gets point 0.1 ml of CBD everyday. So the cat is not so crazy. Well my wife had a cat.

Trevor:  How do you convince a cat to take what you sow.

Brad:  For a cat owner is we actually suggest that they could buy it on they put on the paw because cat will then lick it off Yes because I did not come up with that came from a cat owner from Vancouver.

Trevor: as a pharmacist actually sometimes make medication for cat is the best we can but we have a long skinny syringe to get it to their mouth their sharp teeth getting up putting it and lick it off their own fur. That's good. Yeah.

Brad:  So it's fun to hear the testimonials from people about how dogs and cats horses and chickens and pigs have been happier. They get their puppy back in August 13 14 years old. It's a beautiful story.

Kirk:  How long have you been doing this. How long have you been doing CBD for pets?

Brad:  About 15 months 15 months. It's brand new business. It is. I lost my dog to cancer and I moved into this space.  This is my new puppy. It was a border collie only 11 years old passed away from cancer and her other dog friend, Cooper now has the exact same cancer. Cooper was supposed to euthanize two weeks ago. OK. Cooper still live on my CBD

Kirk: Now, the third one. Yeah, this is geekdom right. This is this is the geek pharmacist walking up to this.

Trevor: I prefer nerd.

Kirk: Nerd. OK, pardon me. Nerd pharmacist is walking up to this fella who is who is another nerd or you got to tell the story. I sat back and just laughed. I thought it was wonderful.

Trevor: Yeah. Dr. Brent Guppy. And I love your last name, Dr. Guppy. He's got a Ph.D. in with genetics. I think there are some pharmacology in there, but mostly genetics. And he had been in Europe for a number of years looking at the genetics of different cultivars here and more than words.

Kirk: So now what's a cultivar?

Trevor: Well, I understand I can be corrected on this, too. I think that just the more proper word for strain. So the different the different types of cannabis out there have different genetics. And he threw some of the work he had been doing in Europe. Bringing it back to North America because of legalization in Canada. He can go into your Licensed Producer and go, OK, if you want to develop a strain that has tons of CBD, these are the genes you should be looking for. If you want to have something that has really high Myrcene, well, the Terpene in there, here's the genetics you've been looking for. Or you say to him, I've got this one strain that everybody really likes and he can do the genetics on that, too. So the genetics of the cannabis plant.

Kirk: Cool.

Dr. Guppy: Sure. So my name is Dr. Brent Guppy. I have a Ph.D. in biochemistry and medical genetics, and I'm currently the president and the chief scientific officer at the Synthase Genetics. And basically, what we do here is we work with legal producers to develop new strains of cannabis with specific, medically relevant properties. So, we would go to a legal producer's grow facility, look at the types of strains that they have available or do a genetic analysis on those strains to look at the specific genes that drive the cannabinoids content, and Terpene content within each strain. So, we specifically look at kind of two classes of genes, the cannabinoids synthase genes. These are the genes responsible for driving the THC, the CBD, the CBG. We also look at other the other gene class, the Terpene synthase gene class. These are the ones that are driving some of the terpene, some of the limonene, myrcene. And what we do is we identify from their candidate breeding stock, optimal breeding pairs to bring together that will produce a new strain, that has a custom kind of cannabinoid profile, a custom terpene profile and therefore a custom medicinal fact. And that's done much rapid the classic way of doing it, which is kind of basically.

Trevor: Trial and error.

Dr. Guppy: Exactly, trial and error. Exactly. And it's like throwing darts in the dark, really. Whereas we're doing more data driven approach. We're empirically looking at the genes that drive these levels of cannabinoids terpenes within the plant. And that way we can accomplish a new strain much quicker than the classical approach.

Trevor: So, if you did develop like a new gene strain instead of just a new phenotype, you could put the patent it. What do you what do we know about patentiblility of genes?

Dr. Guppy: Sure. So, I believe if you wanted to look at the in terms of patents and patenting cannabis. I believe the Purple Kush, they attempted to patent at one point. I think there is actually a US patent for that specific strain. But you can imagine if you develop something that's really novel, something that's really sought after, that you would want to protect your property. You want to protect with a license or with a patent. And how would you do that? Well, one way would be to basically doing a genome sequencing on the plant. The genome is really the blueprint of the plant.

Trevor: Right.

Dr. Guppy: So, if you were to do something like a whole genome sequencing of that plant, you could use that information for patent protection. So, if someone was to take your licensed product copy and try and pass it off as their own, you could take a sample of their product, determine the DNA fingerprinting that product. If it matched yours, then you would know that they're infringing on your patent, on your property right there. So.

Trevor: Cool. And so we know there's like could be hundreds of different cannabinoids and maybe more Terpenes.  How many of them do you know? You know, this gene linked to that Terpene. Do know, like 2, 12, a hundred. What do you guys know so far?

Dr. Guppy: Right. So certainly, that area of research is still young, but it's emerging. And I would say with a high degree of certainty, you can you can correlate certain cannabinoids synthase genes. I would say upwards about 10 right now of the 120 and then roughly about 28 of the Terpene synthase genes.

Trevor: That more that I would have thought.

Dr. Guppy: Exactly. And as the data comes in, we're getting it's becoming more and more robust and we're getting more of that one to one correlation that this gene controls the output of this Terpene. What we're also realizing now is not necessarily a one to one. It's not that limonene synthase only produces Limonene.

Trevor: OK?

Dr. Guppy: There is other Terpenes within that family that it's affecting as well. So some of these enzymes are not only creating one type of terpenes, creating a couple of types of terpenes as well. So it's not necessarily a 1:1 enzyme to chemical, but rather a one enzyme that can control several to produce several different types of Terpenes as well.

Trevor: So we've been getting these questions come up a lot is big difference between Sativa and Indica plants and, you know, Indica in the couch, but it sure seems like it it doesn't matter necessarily the strain and more towards the genes and what cannabinoids are produced. Any thoughts about genetics versus strains?

Dr. Guppy: Right. Yeah. So our idea of Indica and Sativa, I think is a very fuzzy and I think there's a lot of people in the industry believe that Sativa are more uplifting and Indica are more of the Couch Lock. But really, it's whatever people call them. Whether they're high Sativa percentage or any Indica percentage, that doesn't really matter. And in fact, it's kind of a misnomer, I guess you could say.

Kirk: So it's so high CBD from an Indica plant or high CBD from the Sativa plant, you're going to get the same effect.

Dr. Guppy: Exactly, yeah. I mean, those are just terms. Like this Indica Sativa to me, they're just marketing terms. They don't really speak to the genetics origin of the plant.

Kirk: It's so much part of the nomenclature.

Dr. Guppy: I know. And it's an erroneous part of the nomenclature, because what they're really referring to when someone says Sativa has an uplifting effect, they're really referring to the cannabinoid terpene profile. Which classically was more attributed to the land race Sativa. Whereas Indica is derived from India, had more of a myrcene content, which is terpene that's more associated with that of analgesic kind of relaxing effect and also high THC levels in the Indica as well. So what people are calling Indica and Sativa is actually categorically false and really doesn't allow us to really see how that strain is going to affect you medically. It's really about the cannabinoid profile and the terpene profile that's going to give you that specific medicinal effect.

Trevor: And putting on her crystal ball for the moment. What do you see going forward with what we'll call it genotypic and phenotypic changes in in the cannabis plant?

Dr. Guppy: Yeah, sure. So, because this is an industry that's essentially 70 years behind normal agricultural practices, we're going to start to see new strains coming out that are going to be really testing the biological limits of the cannabis plant. Cannabis in the 70s, we're looking at a 3% THC content.  Now, you can see strains upwards 27%, 30%. So, there's going to be a ceiling. So, we're going to find that ceiling. We're going to find out how these genes are interacting with each other. What are the chemical limits of each strain? Can you get high CBD with high THC or is there kind of a balance between those two in terms of the bioproduction of these types of molecules in the plant? So, it's really going to be I think it's going to be a marriage of the understanding of medicine, the understanding of plant genomics and how those kind of come together to produce specific medicinal effects, to give specific relief to certain symptoms and conditions.

Kirk: Well, I was thinking about what you said about the percentages. We talked to a chemist and in her analytical chemistry said that cannabis is so different because we usually talk about part per million in chemistry and genetics. Right. But in cannabis, we're talking about percentage. So, if I got a gram of bud in my hand and it's 27 percent, it's my weight is it not.

Dr. Guppy: Weight by weight.

Kirk: So I guess the question is, can you have 100% THC plant?

Dr. Guppy: Well, I think I'd be pretty odd if you planted a seed in a bunch of oil started using out of the ground. But so we got certainly the biological limits will be tested because, you know, you need to you need energy in the plant to not just produce oil. You have to produce leaf growth.

Kirk: Chlorophyll.

Dr. Guppy: Exactly. Photosynthesis, photosynthetic enzymes, heartiness, certainly trichomes density. These are other genes that are important to us that we also are interested in looking at. Not just the genes that drive cannabinoid and Terpene production, but also genes that are associated with resistance to pest resistance to pests, vigor, heartiness, stalk diameter, things like that, and Trichome density. These are other genes that are that are of our interest and that we look at as well.

Trevor: And I guess wrapping up anything else you think our listeners should just know about cannabis, genetics? So, for your average recreational or medicinal user, what, why should they care about the genetics going into developing that strain?

Dr. Guppy: For sure. So, I think because we were really looking at more of a classical approach with classical breeding techniques where which really is an art form. I have great respect for these kind of master breeders, master growers, because they have an intimate knowledge of how that plant grew from seedling to basically to flower, and they are able to compare qualities between strains and they do it on a subjective basis, which really takes a keen eye and really a connoisseur's touch. So, there's still a place for these types of master breeders, master growers. But what we would like to do is really marry that art form with like data driven science. And that's where we come in. As at Synthase Genetics, we can go on and actually look at the genes that produce these types of chemicals and pair with breeders to identify those really unique strains. And we can also go on to stabilize those unique strains that they have so that when they're creating these custom strains, that they're providing seeds to legal producers or to home cultivators and that those seeds have a very consistent, homogeneous genetic profile so that you're getting consistent canopy height, you're getting consistent terpene profiles, consistent cannabinoid, profiles, and it's just going to it's going to reduce lot to lot variability. And people are going to be happy that they're getting consistency between each grow cycle.

Kirk: So, what is your PhD?

Dr. Guppy: Biochemistry and medical genetics?

Kirk: OK, and so how long you been doing this?

Dr. Guppy: So, we've been we've been accumulating data since 2006. The company's relatively new. We started in January of this year. My background is also in the pharmaceutical drug development and discovery. Where I did that in Europe for a couple of years. Then with the announcement of legalization in Canada, we thought we would take all our data that we've been accumulating for over the past 12 years and turn it into a company that can really help the industry. Really, a gap in the whole industry is having this data driven science, science backed new strain development.

Kirk: And what's been the response?

Dr. Guppy: Great. Yeah, absolutely great. This is a great convention. You've met with a lot of really interesting people. People that are developing new genetics. People that want to have their strain stabilized. People with specific medical conditions that maybe don't really know which Terpene are tailored for their specific medical condition. They want some advice on that because we have a background in medicine. We can provide that advice and kind of direct them along the way.

Kirk: Wow.

Trevor: That's fantastic.

Kirk: Yeah. And that we've got to put the call out again for a botanist. Because we need to talk botanist as well. I guess he...

Trevor: To explain a cultivar to us.

Kirk: But so, there are people out there that are that are starting to get into niches of this marketplace. Right. And this is what I think is so cool about this, about cannabis becoming legal in Canada. We're creating a brand new industry and these things are popping up. Another guy we met, another guy we met briefly. I'm sorry, are we done, enough time we talked to Guppy.

Trevor: Yeah, yeah, we're good. We're good on Guppy.

Kirk: Good on Guppy. That's great name.

Trevor: Synthase Genetics, sorry, we might as well mention the company.

Kirk: Say that again.

Trevor: Synthase Genetics.

Kirk: Synthase Genetics. I got to get that tongue working. Now, the other guy and this was just a conversation we didn't record, but a guy now in Winnipeg has a portable chemistry lab, right?

Trevor: Yeah. And they came up to us and gave us after we, well, talking to everyone. You guys want my card. And yes, of course we want your card.

Kirk: Someday we'll call you because we had too many stories here. We got so many stories in the can that we got to get to. And please be patient with us.  Those people that we've interviewed, we have a plan to get you up, hopefully before Christmas. Now, one other interview we got on tape was with the.

Trevor: 420 Group in Winnipeg. Yes.

Kirk: And I kind of.

Trevor: So just in case nobody, people don't know. Kirk, tell us a little bit what's 420? What's the history of 420? What is 420 mean?

Kirk: Well, 420 comes from California. Back in the 1970s, a group of kids from a school used to meet at 4:20 at a statue. Now, I don't have that Wikipedia in front of me, but essentially, these four guys used to meet at 4:20 in the afternoon and smoked a reefer and that that name just sort of carried on. So 420 is, April 20th, and what happens now across the western world is their sit ins.

Trevor: So and this one in Winnipeg, I forget how many years, but it's been a number of years, they have one at the legislative building basically saying, you know, cannabis should be legal. So last decade or so, this is what they do.

Kirk: Yes. And this is going across Canada. I mean, I never seem to be able to be around some place to get there. Usually around April 20th, I'm in the north usually because the middle of April is working time for me. But this year we had the conversation about what's going to happen when cannabis is legal. I'm sorry, what are we going to do with Prohibition 2.0 cannabis in Manitoba where you can't smoke cannabis anywhere except maybe your house. Maybe your house. If you got small children, maybe you shouldn't. I don't know.

Trevor: Yeah. And he talked about how, frankly, relatively easy it's been when cannabis was illegal to get like it's like a parade permit to an event permit to be at legislative grounds. And the police didn't bother them when they got all the right permits. And it was relatively easy. What happens now? And then you guys go down to the big folk festival in Manitoba at Bird Hill Park. Right. What happens there? So, yeah, it was a good conversation.

Kirk: Yeah. Yeah. Let's have a listen to that one. 

Nathan: My name is Nathan. I am the VP of Community Outreach for the Winnipeg420 Organizing Committee.

Kirk: OK, so you're very aware of what's happening with legalization of cannabis in Manitoba?

Nathan: Yes, sir.

Kirk: And you're aware of the new finds are coming up?

Nathan: Yes, sir. They're pretty high.

Kirk: So how do you think how do you think your events are going to change with the new coming legislation where they're going to hand out fines for public smoking?

Nathan: It'll really depend on how that works. I mean, again, this event has been going on for a long time. It is definitely civil disobedience. Even if the organizing committee weren't involved at all, there would still be people there smoking on the legislature 420. Right. They're not going to start arresting people because that would be just really bad news day. And let's be fair, the Jets will probably could be in the playoffs again. They'll have more important things to worry about.

Kirk: OK, and you're right. You know, how are they going to arrest a thousand people? Right.

Nathan: They're not going to know.

Kirk: They're not going to. And they haven't and they haven't.

Nathan: They haven't, the Winnipeg Police Department is pretty good about that kind of thing. For the part.

Kirk: However, with the coming new legislation, I mean, let's look at the Winnipeg Folk Festival. How many people how many people enjoy their medicine at the Winnipeg Folk Festival?

Nathan: Right. Exactly right.

Kirk: So and officers have walked by and smile. Right. But with the new coming like legislation, do you foresee officers actually fining people?

Nathan: Probably not a that event. No, because again, it's a case where it's too many people to really get to. I could see them maybe making a token here or there. But for the most part, No.  I don't think they'll be.

Kirk: It's interesting, though, isn't it?

Nathan: I don't really go out of their way to enforce the laws.

Kirk: Well,.

Nathan: I don't think they'll go out of their way. I think they'll be the sort of laws that they'll enforce. They pulled you over or they think they're dealing with you for another reason.

Kirk: So 420 2019, you don't foresee guys making their quota for the month, getting all their Fines out of the way?

Nathan: I don't think so. I really don't, I think we may have to.

Kirk: How would you respond as an organization if they did, how would you respond?

Nathan: We might have to make ourselves a medical event this year? Because if we're a medical group. Honestly, I can't see us getting permitting if we were to recreational necessarily. I mean, maybe we'll be able to work, if we can that would be awesome. So but I think it's far more likely that we need that.

Kirk: So what kind of performance were you getting when it was against the law?

Nathan: Standard? We were getting our I guess technically I'm not actually sure of the exact nature of the permit. I was only involved with that a little bit last year.

Trevor:  Thank you for and how about just a promo thing. Tell us anything exciting coming up for 420 2019.

Nathan: They'll be for stuff upcoming and obviously they'll be 420 this year, but we're hoping to get more events off the ground in the future.

Trevor: Where the best place for people to find the 420 organization.

Nathan: Probably on Facebook right now.

Kirk: All right. Thank you very much for doing this.

Kirk: So that so that was interesting. It almost makes me want to go back to a Birds Hill folk festival. I haven't been to one in a couple of years. I think I've probably been to five or six of them over the last four decades. My first folk festival in 1980, Stan Rogers was playing and oh God, I can just come up Tony Bird.

Trevor: I think last year Stan son was up there.

Kirk: Probably. Stan and trying to think of the other fella Van Zandt was playing. I picked up a lot of my musical interest back in 1980, but I digress with Birds Hill.

Trevor: Shocking.

Kirk: Strainprint. Let's talk about Strainprint.

Trevor: Yeah. One of the really cool things that I've been reading with Strainprint is getting involved in an endometriosis study. So endometriosis version, jump in. If I get this wrong, it's when the lining of the uterus sort of leaves the uterus and grows places is not supposed to and you get lots of extra pain and bleeding.

Kirk: Yes,.

Trevor: I think the short version.

Kirk: Yes.

Trevor: And I hadn't even thought about using cannabis for endometriosis, but apparently some people have and it's worked. But this isn't just anecdotal evidence. They're getting involved in doing an actual study because what the Strainprint do really well, Collect data,.

Kirk: Collect data. They are a data machine. We promoted Strainprint in Season one. You can you can go to the Advocates and listen Strainprint's interview. It is a fabulous one. And we become sort of friends online. We Strainprint and they are sponsoring this show. And so we encourage people to go to www.strainprint.ca and download the app. We encourage you to download it if you're using cannabis as medicine because it allows you to track your use. I'm encouraging people to use it recreational because again I declared in my belief in doing this podcast that cannabis is medicine all the time.

Trevor: You have. And but back to the medicinal bit because you mentioned it before, you know, both of us have experience with diabetic logs. This really for if you're a medicinal user, this is kind of your diabetic log for your cannabis. This strain effect affected me how? So, it's it really is one of these why didn't I think of that moment, you know, app for tracking your cannabis use. That's fantastic.

Kirk: As a recreational learner, learner, user, recreational user of cannabis, I want to start using cannabis with searching out Terpenes and stuff. And we talked about that in the last episode, how you can now burn cannabis with vaporizes at different temperatures to get different effects. So Strainprint guys, good product.

Trevor: It's free. Download it, try it.

Kirk: Yeah. And all they're doing is gathering data that's only going to make cannabis more legit out there. Now talking about legit, we have in My Cannabis Story this time.

Trevor: So it was someone you were talking to and I like this story. So he started out doing what?

Kirk: Well, I'll let him I'll let him tell us. But this is this is a classic situation, Trevor, where cannabis is a new industry. So people are dropping into the industry from way out there in other things.

Trevor: All over the place.

Kirk: All over the place. Now, this story is about a gentleman that discovered the industry. So I want to make it put a little caveat in there. Now, there are lots of people that have been in the cannabis industry through the medicinal side as ACMPR growers and people that have basically blood, sweat and tears who are the die hards that actually promoted and pushed the government. And we learned in our last episode that any changes in cannabis.

Trevor: Required a lawsuit.

Kirk: Required a lawsuit. So the people that did that, a lot of those guys, because of the way the government has unfolded, legalization of cannabis across the country, a lot of those people have been sort of left out. We're going to talk to them and we're going to get stories on them in the future. So please be patient with us. This story is about a fella who jumped from one industry to another. So let's listen to this gentleman. This is this. He calls himself Delta9 Daniel, let's listen to Delta9 Daniel,.

Trevor: Let's have a listen.

Daniel: I was actually in sales.

Kirk: OK.

Daniel: Yeah. So my background actually was car sales, door to door sales, phone sales. I did all the sales.

Kirk: All right.

Daniel: So one day I was just sitting there and bored at work, selling cars, couldn't find a client, and then going down the Winnipeg Free Press. And I noticed that there was legalization about to occur. And the License Producer called Delta9 and I thought to myself, wow, there's a lot of car salesmen out there, probably in the thousands. How many pot salesmen there are? One, two, maybe. Legally, none. Yeah. So none legally. And I was the first.  So I applied for the job, applied for the role. Got it. Came here and I'll never look back.

Kirk: All right. Go ahead and say it.

Trevor: I love stories like that. Yeah. You know, and I want to hear more medicinal stories. So keeping them coming in, you know, I had Syndrome X, I took cannabis, I got better. But I want to hear more of those. They are fascinating because I always learn something from those. But but give us your other cannabis stories too. You there's got to be a bunch of interesting entrepreneurs out there who are doing, oh, I never even thought about that.  Or I jumped into the cannabis industry because yeah, we want to hear them all.

Kirk: I have I have heard so many antidotal are people with arthritis. I mean, I think I read a paper or a new study out there. They've actually discovered that cannabis may actually shrink the inflammation of arthritis.

Trevor: Well, yeah. And we talked about that a little bit with our with our researcher a while let's see if I get it right. I think it is the and the c2 of the receptors.

Kirk:  CBD2 receptor.

Trevor: Yeah. Is the anti-inflammatory part.

Kirk: Right. That's the anti-inflammatory, that's correct. And what they've discovered now is that we've hearing stories that people are actually getting less, less inflammation from their from their arthritis. Now these are anecdotal, but I don't know where I saw this. I mean, I'm reading so much stuff online and I'm going into deep literature on is someplace somewhere someone is doing a study discovered that it actually decreases the swelling, pardon me, it may actually decrease the swelling. But I'm getting anecdotally that it is. I mean, I got people I've got patients that I deal with that I'm not allowed because of confidentiality to discuss or interview because I mean, I'm in a role. But they've told me in their history gathering that they smoke cannabis for the last five years because of their arthritis. So if you're out there and you're doing cannabis because your arthritis, let us know, because we're getting people that are saying, I want to hear more my stories. Yeah, we can only give them if you give us the stories.

Trevor: Yes. Send us a story through the website www.reefermed.ca click on My Cannabis Stories, all the info there about how to send us stuff.

Kirk: And online. Let us know where you listen to us. We know that you're in Mongolia. There's a guy, there's someone in Mongolia downloaded two episodes. Somewhere in South Africa, they downloaded stories. Santa Fe I think is yes. The third largest city that's been listening to us.

Trevor: Yeah. And we've got southern Ontario up to northern Alberta to, you know, all across Canada. So, yeah, let us know let us know where you're listening and, you know, actually really cool. Take a take a selfie of us of you listening to us in your hometown and we'll post.

Kirk: That well posted. Certainly. Yeah. Do that. That's a good idea.

Trevor: Every once in a while.

Kirk: Spark. Turn the light off turn the light off.  Alright, today's song we're still in 100 mile diet. Someone said that Dauphin didn't have an art scene. My God, how many episodes were on to now? Like. Like lots.

Trevor: Like lots.

Kirk: Like lots, man.

Trevor: And I think you listen to this one first at a folk festival in the area.

Kirk: And her family, actually, the Harvest Sun Music Festival happens in August every year. Alana Levandoski, this is from her album Lions and Werewolf. I love this song is Red Rover, another talented person from the Parkland region.

Trevor: Yeah. Let's have a listen to Alana.

Kirk: And we should talk about cannabis, tourism and Dauphin.

Trevor: Yeah, that's coming.

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